GS Drum kits in the soundtrack archive

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quattj
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Joined: Mon May 03, 2021 12:26 pm

GS Drum kits in the soundtrack archive

Post by quattj » Mon May 03, 2021 1:20 pm

I am currently writing a MIDI file instrument changer. I have downloaded various MIDI files in the different formats (GM, GS, XG). One of my main test files for GS is ROBIN-GS.MID from The Legend of Robin Hood: Conquests of the Longbow from
https://www.midimusicadventures.com/que ... undtracks/

I'm curious about the percussion in the file. It has program changes on Channel 10 for 0 and 7. From what I have gathered, program changes on channel 10 in a GS file select the drum kit to use. However, there does not appear to be a kit #7 in any of the info I have. I am mainly using kit info from the SC-8850, although the SC-55, SC-88, and SC-88 Pro also do not have kit 7.

If you look at the screenshot, all of the percussion in white exists in kit 0 "STANDARD 1".
The percussion in grey (with no names, 90, 92, 94) is not part of kit 0.
The percussion in grey WITH names falls after the program change 7, so presumably would be in the non-existent #7 kit, but because there is no 7, it reverts to a grey display of the same percussion from kit 0.

Can someone provide me more info on what might be going on here?
Attachments
robin-gs_missing.png

Spikey
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Re: GS Drum kits in the soundtrack archive

Post by Spikey » Thu May 06, 2021 9:28 am

It has program changes on Channel 10 for 0 and 7. From what I have gathered, program changes on channel 10 in a GS file select the drum kit to use. However, there does not appear to be a kit #7 in any of the info I have.
That's because - there is no #7 kit in GS!
A Patch 0 program change is an MT-32 sent patch for "default drum kit" (in GM as well). A few MT-32 games change the kit, although not many and not often. My guess is that patch 7 is leftover from the MT-32 score and should be deleted.
Upon checking it against the MT-32 score, the patch 7 kit is there for the same 2 tracks (Rescuing Marian/failed Rescue). It's therefore a mistake in the conversion and should be deleted.

Cross-checking with the master files, which I have for this game, the drumkit is still set to patch 7 for the MT-32 original score. The naming it has for the channel is "Tambourine", so it would seem that custom drumkit is better for tambourine sounds.
The percussion in grey (with no names, 90, 92, 94) is not part of kit 0.
The percussion in grey WITH names falls after the program change 7, so presumably would be in the non-existent #7 kit, but because there is no 7, it reverts to a grey display of the same percussion from kit 0.
I would imagine the notes are MT-32 drum notes that were not converted over correctly. That or because the kit is invalid, the correct notes are being flagged in your software.

Suggestion - pick a different "complete soundtrack" file for your default "test case". :)

Longbow aside, welcome! Do you have a website or place where one can learn more about you or your work?

quattj
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Joined: Mon May 03, 2021 12:26 pm

Re: GS Drum kits in the soundtrack archive

Post by quattj » Fri May 07, 2021 12:47 am

Haha, well, at least I know it's working properly for GS files :p

I do not have a website, though there are remnants of my old Geocities site floating around the internet, which probably wouldn't be of interest at this point.

I DO have the previous BETA version of my program on google drive.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... sp=sharing

Note, however, that it's from *several weeks* ago (so old!) and has no bank selection or bank display functionality, and 3 bugs I have since fixed (2 mouse-wheel issues, and a screenshot issue... don't take a screenshot :p). It CAN successfully change instruments in every midi file I tested, just 0-127 are your options, so if there are multiple banks used in a file, you get whatever bank it's on when you change it. (So, GS bank 1 program 3 change to 4 would remain on bank 1, though all instruments in that version display the GM bank 0 for everything). But it's still good to fiddle around with and try out if you want to see what I'm going for. If you do, let me know.

What actually made me finally decide to add bank support is I was fiddling with a Castlevania medley, and because the banks are not all 0, I ended up with a scream as one of the instruments, and decided for completeness sake, I want to be able to select that scream ON PURPOSE ;)

jaffa225man
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Re: GS Drum kits in the soundtrack archive

Post by jaffa225man » Sat May 08, 2021 2:03 am

quattj wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 12:47 am
Haha, well, at least I know it's working properly for GS files :p

I do not have a website, though there are remnants of my old Geocities site floating around the internet, which probably wouldn't be of interest at this point.

I DO have the previous BETA version of my program on google drive.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... sp=sharing

Note, however, that it's from *several weeks* ago (so old!) and has no bank selection or bank display functionality, and 3 bugs I have since fixed (2 mouse-wheel issues, and a screenshot issue... don't take a screenshot :p). It CAN successfully change instruments in every midi file I tested, just 0-127 are your options, so if there are multiple banks used in a file, you get whatever bank it's on when you change it. (So, GS bank 1 program 3 change to 4 would remain on bank 1, though all instruments in that version display the GM bank 0 for everything). But it's still good to fiddle around with and try out if you want to see what I'm going for. If you do, let me know.

What actually made me finally decide to add bank support is I was fiddling with a Castlevania medley, and because the banks are not all 0, I ended up with a scream as one of the instruments, and decided for completeness sake, I want to be able to select that scream ON PURPOSE ;)
Modification of MIDI instruments is quite a fun and creative pursuit of happiness. I'm sure you'll enjoy it as much as I have. It's intoxicating to make every MIDI file you've amassed sound exactly the way you wish they'd been created. To me, It's especially nice when sounds can be "upgraded" with more modern sound modules that weren't around when DOS games reigned, or when GM compatibility corralled musicians into using sounds that will work on everything, with the effect of sounding just alright on everything.

Actually, I've been doing something similar with qmidiroute for GNU/Linux. When I began my play, I was surprised how easily MIDI makes available changes like this, and how much can be accomplished. Of course, MIDI remapping is just modification of hexadecimal so computers (and microcontrollers) are perfect for the task. I have yet to see feedback on my qmidiroute changes, though. That's probably due to my poor topic naming, lengthy, seemingly-complex explanations, inexperienced coding abilities, or any combination. The esoteric nature of MIDI nowadays could also be a detractor. It probably would find a wider audience in windows users if I'd suggested using it through a raspberry pi. With the lack of discussion, though, that hasn't come up. Although, even that would require some GNU/Linux tinkering experience, as I've only provided patches along with the required, unusually complex, instructions on how to build them with the qmidiroute source code, so far.

There is purposeful screaming in some Castlevania remixes, but I wasn't able to find it tonight.

I like the style of your interface!

Thanks,

Lucas

quattj
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon May 03, 2021 12:26 pm

Re: GS Drum kits in the soundtrack archive

Post by quattj » Sat May 08, 2021 4:05 pm

jaffa225man wrote:
Sat May 08, 2021 2:03 am
Modification of MIDI instruments is quite a fun and creative pursuit of happiness. I'm sure you'll enjoy it as much as I have. It's intoxicating to make every MIDI file you've amassed sound exactly the way you wish they'd been created. To me, It's especially nice when sounds can be "upgraded" with more modern sound modules that weren't around when DOS games reigned, or when GM compatibility corralled musicians into using sounds that will work on everything, with the effect of sounding just alright on everything.
Yes, it's something I've been messing with for years, so now I'll have a much better way to do it.
I also use CoolSoft VirtualMIDISynth for my MIDI playback device, so I have access to any and all SF2 soundfonts I download. I mostly use Timbres Of Heaven if I want "realistic", or a combo of assorted NES and OPL soundfonts when I want that retro sound.

Actually, I've been doing something similar with qmidiroute for GNU/Linux. When I began my play, I was surprised how easily MIDI makes available changes like this, and how much can be accomplished. Of course, MIDI remapping is just modification of hexadecimal so
I'd be curious to see it (though I have windows, so I'd be relegated to watching a video or viewing screenshots)

I like the style of your interface!
Thanks!

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